HiPiHi, I don't need another Second Life — I've already got one

2007-08-21

I've been in the practice of exploring online worlds other than Second Life because I'm an explorer, and I'm by no means confined to one metaverse, game, gametaverse — whatever the cool kids are calling them these days. But I gotta call out baldercrap when I see it:

"It is absolutely a misunderstanding of the virtual world if people think HiPiHi is a copycat of SecondLife. The virtual world is not just a 3D environment, but a complicate social system including the property policy, financial policy etc."
-Hui Xu from this Mobinode interview

Wait a sec, that sounds exactly like Second Life. Heck, even if I didn't work for Linden Lab, even if I was a 3-year-old all over again, it doesn't take a Kaku, much less a Coffey to see the sheer resemblance between these two claims:

"HiPiHi World is a 3D digital world as rich and complex as the real world, and is created, inhabited and owned by its residents.The residents are the Gods of this virtual world; it is a world of limitless possibilities for creativity and self-expression, within a complex social structure and a full functioning economy."

sourced from here, compared to an older description of SL:

"Second Life is a 3-D virtual world entirely built and owned by hundreds of thousands of residents from around the globe. From the moment you enter, you'll be surrounded by the creations of your fellow residents. Because residents retain the rights to their digital creations, they can buy, sell and trade with others, or exchange Linden dollars to/from US dollars."

which has since been updated and expanded at the "What is…" page.

Maybe that's not convincingly specific enough. So, how about this…

I'm a big fan of mythology, and the whole "Residents are Gods" thing sounds empowering, but wait — why is HiPiHi referring to their users as "Residents" too? Couldn't you guys call them "citizens", "denizens", "kinfolk", another synonym from your Chinese-English thesaurus, or do you just really like our name and the history that comes with it? I can't wait to see if you'll use our colloquial abbreviation of "Resi" too.

Try as I might to keep turning giving the benefit of the doubt, SuezanneC Baskerville (thanx!), who's also a Resident in Second Life, has blogged frequently about her adventures in HiPiHi, has uploaded numerous pictures showing many of the sad, sad similarities.

On the plus side, their terrain editor looks a lot more versatile, they've already got a type of reflective ripple water, and some of the prebuild stuff looks slick. More comparisons and pros/cons are helpfully covered at sites like Spunlogic and Centric. But if you're going to lick Linden Lab's crib notes, please don't copy the wrinkles and warts of our user interface too:

Hipihi_Prim_Editor_Prim_Parameters.jpg image by SuezanneC-Baskerville

The "unflattery" doesn't end inworld; hmmmm, let's have a look at Second Life's website layout and theirs!

Second Life website blatantly copied by HiPiHi

Different meat, but the bones are almost the same. And hey, in the lower-left corner with the scroll bars, that's where they put their press stories too! (Some of which incidentally have "Second Life" in the title; what a way to feed off of our hype aura.) It'll be "interesting" to see, to say the least, if they continue to dopplegang and clone future revisions. (As tempting as it may be, I advise against putting in intentional mistakes and seeing if they get copied too. :p)

Before I move on, let me just say I'm not proud of Chinese people being saddled with a stereotype for shamefully imitating innovations from 'round the globe; being part Chinese myself, I think my lineage did pretty well inventing abacus-things, chopsticks, gunpowder, and the surprisingly controversial needle-poking that is acupuncture. But, fast forward to 2007, and what splashes across the world news? All the stories about Chinese copycats which cloud earnest creation. Let's not forget the Chinese iPhone ripoff and Komoo, which is clearly Chinese for Twitter. If you're going to duplicate the efforts of others, at least be volumes better; don't just clone the bulk of what we already know and toss us a removable battery like a feeble bone, or whatever. And if you've been influenced or inspired, it's a simple and nice thing to graciously acknowledge the source of your riffing. I do it all the time.

(This ain't the saga of Leibniz and Newton told in cyberspace, my friends. Nor is it a Mr. Sparkle-style coincidence.)

Finally, HiPiHi if you pride user-created content, please find a Resi to make a better piano, 'cuz the one on your website is the lamest I've ever seen:

The lamest piano I've ever seen - from HiPiHi

I'd rather perform on this, and this is pre-WindLight (gosh forbid we see a HiPiHi advance dubbed "AirRight"):

Playing the piano!

HiPiHi really owe it to themselves to tread new ground like other virtual worlds instead of scuttling over LL's scraps.

I enjoy visiting fertile new grounds and savoring new experiences, but I don't need another Second Life — I've already got one.

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Another snow clone « My Metaverse in the Making
2007-08-22 at 9:17 AM UTC

{ 17 comments… read them below or add one }

Daedalus Young 2007-08-22 at 8:25 AM UTC

We should see if they have/get Sculpties. It'd be cool though if they'd be interchangable, that'd mean QSS would be a standard. And then hopefully others will implement it and we'll get the proper exporters built in our fav 3D editors.

Blogland Oh 2007-08-22 at 8:45 AM UTC

I have tried HippyHigh

Mellon Snow to you too! You nutter! HAHA
Of course, I haven't tried HiPiHi yet, (Does the yet mean anything?) I'm having too much fun with SL!! strangely enough another friend spoke of it.

I think it's the amount of times the grid's been off and on, the amount of hardware the lindens must go through you could probably build a shed with to store your watermelons matey.

Although I would expect HiPiHi to be premature so of course it is versatile at the moment, so was SL when it first came out right…I don't know I was on dial up in those days.

The point is what hurts us makes us stronger, the future can only be stronger either that or we will all crash and burn and HiPiHi will repeat history the same way

I just tried to join it to try and snatch the name Torley Linden, then I could reply to your youtube vids with even crazier vid's as the alternate Torley Linden of HippyHigh! Yet even Google Translator couldn't find out what the hell they were saying.

Just let them be, Let's just say they are in a league of their own

Ann Marie Simard 2007-08-22 at 9:02 AM UTC

Hiya here Torley and friends. I took a look and might even test-drive just to see what horrible things would happen if I tried to rezz artwork there :s (or maybe not my artwork… noooo) – The blurb set me off too – very much alike SL's, seems they have just added a "elven" / fantasy MMO feature to attract a larger customer basis. This girl here thinks it's not going to live very long, but I'll test drive and post about it when more informed. :)

Juliet Ceres 2007-08-22 at 12:39 PM UTC

Awww Torley… someone copied your Software. You gonna cry?
I for one really love seeing some competition, even if it's just in chinese…

If they will give us a nice english interface and just a tad more stability, I'm gone. And with me a lot of other content providers.

Wake up!

Nina Andrews 2007-08-22 at 3:28 PM UTC

Competition leads to innovation! This is a good thing for us customers, Torley, unless you think that SL won't be up to the challenge.

Hexx Triskaidekaphobia 2007-08-23 at 2:06 AM UTC

Ehm, considering that a day still has only 24 hours and that I have to spend most of those on Otherworld matters, I see no chance to squeeze another SL in. I do hope our Chinese brothers and sisters won't hold it against me.

Juliet Ceres 2007-08-23 at 2:45 AM UTC

No problem Hexx, just log into HiPiHI whenever SL is down or broken…

Ante Flan 2007-08-23 at 11:24 AM UTC

I've been following this, as well. It really is a ripoff. No offense, but you've gotta love China. It seems like somebody there is always willing to copy something that gets a little publicity. Like, with the success of the ipod, a lot of companies have been trying to make their own music players, but they always try to add some innovations to it to try to make it better and not look like a ripoff. Now, with this Chinese iphone, it looks like they tried their best to make it look as close to the real iphone as possible, and even used their logos. The worst I've probably seen is Chinese Disney land. Of course, they put as many popular cartoon characters in there as possible, not just Disney. Isn't there some sort of international copyright thing to keep people from getting away with this stuff, or is China not included or something?

But yeah, it looks like they tried to make it look as close to secondlife as possible. The UI and website are all pretty much the same, but it looks like they have a few different features (and they are probably missing some, too). It also doesn't look all that great. I mean, SL hasn't really changed in years, aside from ripple water and such, and the character models and stuff still look better. Also, the ripple water is pretty bad looking in most of those pictures. Windlight/reflective ripple water looks awesome. I can't wait for that.

So yeah, I don't know. I'm sure anyone who has ever played SL will realize it is a ripoff, and it's not looking all that great, anyway. I guess you have nothing to worry about unless they allow gambling. :P

Elvis Orbit 2007-08-23 at 5:04 PM UTC

Well if people were upset about SL having to follow US law now on HiPiHi you will be subjected to follow Chinese law. Perhaps this might be more restrictive. Can you say major censorship.
Elvis

Ante Flan 2007-08-23 at 5:22 PM UTC

Oh yeah, people are going to love that when they figure that out. :P

Elvis Orbit 2007-08-23 at 7:45 PM UTC

Yes they will love it. As well who knows if there will be an economic system like lindens than can be traded for real money. And would you give your Credit Card details to a them? From what I read of it so far you can't even get the avatars naked LOL.

Ante Flan 2007-08-24 at 10:56 AM UTC

Well, I'm pretty sure you can upload textures, and you can always wear clothes to make you look naked, but do they allow that? I don't know. I signed up to test it out, but I didn't read much. Most of the English is pretty bad. I think it said "If you have not download the client, please do that firstly." when I finished signing up. Also, if you didn't finish the page in, like, a minute, it would time out and you'd need to start over from the beginning, which was annoying, because I was doing other things at the time. It also downloaded at 6 kbps, so that sure was lovely. I wonder how the servers are for the game. I'll have to keep on wondering, though, because it crashes on the loading screen in Vista. Sure, you could say it's Vista's fault and nothing works on Vista and blah, blah, blah, but the truth is, Vista isn't as bad as people make it out to be, and most old stuff that was made even before Vista was announced (or even XP, in some cases) works on it (including SL, which I ran on the Vista beta long before it was released), so there is absolutely no excuse for something that was released in '07, or even '06 to not work on Vista. Microsoft gave developers what they need, and Vista is fine, from what I've seen. Vista's only problem is the bad 3rd party support when it comes to drivers and some software (x-fi is absolutely horrible on Vista. I started using my motherboard's sound because of it).

Al Sonic 2007-08-25 at 5:51 PM UTC

"intentional mistakes"… That'd sound almost tempting, as it sure works for mapmakers catching others in the act of copying their works.

"Can you say 'major censorship'?" Heh, given the past public outcry (perhaps multiple waves of 'em) about LL's legally-cautious moves, I think numerous residents have already proven they easily can. Just don't expect to be able to say it inside HiPiHi ;D.

Sure China can easily copy the code, and they may copy the plan, but if they think they can copy the service, and the essential, empowering community spirit of Linden Lab… ROFLMAOZEDUNG!

Al Sonic 2007-08-25 at 5:54 PM UTC

Aw man, I misspelled Zedong again….

Torley 2007-08-26 at 8:34 AM UTC

@Daed: Oh yeah, let's send Qarl and Periapse Linden over on a mission of peace. :D Or at least sculptie-able Resis like Cel Edman and Anjin Meiji to extoll these virtues!

@Blogland: Wow bold formatting! As someone who enjoys vicarious sci-fi romps through spacetime, alternate realities (and virtual realities) appeal to me, but this is sorta like one of the "sadder, defective counterfeit" worlds from Sliders. It blots out the appeal of what *is* unique. Everyone has a right, a choice to forge their own path. Please don't impersonate me though, I'm not Elvis. Flattered tho! ;)

@Ann: Hm, if I want fantasy I'd be more compelled to do WoW, Guild Wars, Everquest II, etc. I like Chinese mythology being explored but it isn't clear whether HPH is just using that sketchily, or intend to have more of a narrative storyline.

@Juliet: There's no need for you to be repeatedly rude here, doesn't help anyone. I'd rather you keep making video tutorials. Thank-you in advance!

@Nina: I'm all for innovation, but as I've mentioned earlier, HPH's own strengths are blanketed in a sea of copycattery a la http://www.techcrunch.com/2007/04/26/aol-one-step-behind-again-new-home-page-identical-to-yahoo/ . Not admirable.

@Ante: I cringe being associated by knockoff; one good thing of course is they mention "Second Life" so much on their website. Free publicity works that way too.

@Elvis: Ha, good point! Hey, I wonder if casinos are in HPH? o.O

@Al: Thanks, I find "Zedong" in itself isn't really an accurate phonetic spelling. I usually go with "Tse Tung" myself but what the heck do I know.

So, some Lindens discussed this very topic this week, and I'm also aware of some of the lateral advantages: e.g., as pointed out, if people become familiar with the imitation they may want a taste of the "real deal". Or, it'll lead to common metaverse conventions better understood across various softwares (not just SL and HPH but beyond —) and that's also good for sharing knowledge and learning curves, because I agree that all this online world stuff has a LONG way to go in terms of usability.

Every point here has a counterpoint, but again, the above evidence I presented stands. I hold to my original point that you can be inspired and create something superior without being a tawdry knock-off. Take the musician Brian Transeau (BT) for example, he's a marvellous example of someone who's assimilated styles and made them his own. Listen to "Lullaby for Gaia" for an amped-up homage to New Order, or the Braindance-tipped stutter edits (6,000+ of them) peppered through the otherwise radio-friendly "Somnambulist". Now *that's* taking existing sources and being not just creatively expressive, but substantially successful!

SuezanneC Baskerville 2007-08-27 at 11:31 PM UTC

Someone must need a hug.

saraheve burger 2008-01-03 at 8:08 PM UTC

hey torley :) … lol i kinda agree about the hipihi thing but i still wanna try it out………but i cant because it keeps saying something about a image code… gosh could it be any harder to register lol

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